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In episode 8, I talk to the Vogel brothers (Josh and Drew) about going from white belt to black belt together, training at Balance, competing, training with Saulo and Xande Ribeiro, teaching, the loss of their mom, support from Brian Cimins of Grapplers Quest, Rafael and Guilherme Mendes, Tom and Terry Brands, the evolution of “basic” jiu jitsu, etc.
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